- cross-posted to:
- news@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- news@lemmy.world
Updates:
Might be best for mods to lock this post at this point (is that a thing on Lemmy?) because this story is basically wrapped. The FBI says a bullet caused some ear damage. Maybe it was bullet shrapnel from a ricochet or something like that, but later photos show the teleprompters in-tact so it wasn’t shards of glass from those. Trump’s usage of the bandage (and the assassination attempt) as symbols and political tools has been discussed at length and I don’t think conspiratorial thinking beyond that is very productive. Pete Souza took his own account down after getting a lot of harassment, so no further conspiracies are needed regarding X-formerly-known-as-Twitter at this time.
A photo of Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump taken on Saturday without his ear bandage has sparked a wave of speculation.
The image, taken by Alex Brandon of the Associated Press on July 27 and shared by photojournalist Pete Souza on X, formerly Twitter, shows Trump walking up an airplane staircase with an apparently fully healed ear wound just weeks after he was shot with a high-powered rifle.
Souza, known for his tenure as the chief official White House photographer for Presidents Ronald Reagan and Barack Obama, posted Brandon’s photo on his now-deactivated X account on Saturday, writing, “AP photo this morning. Look closely at his ear that was ‘hit’ by a bullet from an AR-15 assault rifle.”
Souza’s profile, @PeteSouza, which had over 200,000 followers, now reads, “This account doesn’t exist, try searching for another,” implying that he has deleted or deactivated it. If he had been banned, it would read, “Account suspended. X suspends accounts which violate the X rules.”
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Speaking for myself, my eyebrows are not raised. I remember reading that day that it was a shattered teleprompter or other shrapnel that nicked or sliced his ear, not that a bullet had passed through it. In any case, I personally don’t quite understand the importance of the distinction. He was shot at either way, no? If it were a nick by glass I imagine it would’ve healed by now.
Edit: I forgot to mention… Fuck Trump and his ilk, they deserve being two-time losers come November.
Getting hit by a bullet makes it more dramatic and makes him more of a martyr for his rabid cult fans. If it didn’t hit him then there’s always the hint of the question - “was he the actual target?”. Which makes him less important to his fans.
It was just a mass shooting: you know, the thing that keeps happening in America that no one cares about…
Let’s see how much they make of it when it’s one of their self-selected elites injured by the gunman.
And let’s remind them it’s too early to speak about shootings. Let’s get some clarity and distance from this vigilante shooting over a crowd of people with an AR before we weigh in.
Plus, although being shot at is pretty close to dying of course, a bullet grazing your head is exponentially closer to dying than it missing by several feet and some shrapnel or whatever gives you a little nick
Good point, I guess that gives me some justification for my stance that it isn’t important. I wouldn’t want to stoop to the level of his fans.
“was he the actual target?”
I mean he probably was, right?
FBI officially stated that it was a bullet, not shrapnel, after expressing initial uncertainty plus unhealthy 78 year olds heal slowly, hence the raised eyebrows.
Probably he was legit shot at - I think it’s irrational to believe it was staged with the evidence we currently have - but fascists love false-flag and staged attacks. Hitler’s Reichstag Fire, Putin’s Russian Appartment Bombings are two recent examples. Even Pisastratus, the 5thC BCE tyrant of Athens staged a fake attack on himself to generate sympathy and justify an armed guard which he then used to seize the acropolis.
So I can definitely see why eyebrows raise quickly when a would be tyrant is suspiciously unscathed.
“What struck former President Trump in the ear was a bullet, whether whole or fragmented into smaller pieces, fired from the deceased subject’s rifle,” the agency said in a statement.
They’re saying it could have been a fragment of a bullet, which would qualify as shrapnel. They’re not using that word.
Thank you! So the FBI is still saying it was shrapnel, they just stopped using the word shrapnel so trump can have his BS narrative. That’s healthy for our democracy.
speculation from last week by FBI director Christopher Wray about whether Trump’s ear was hit by a bullet or by shrapnel. The FBI later confirmed he was hit by a bullet.
But then you have to click ‘hit by a bullet’ to find out they’re using bullet as a euphemism for shrapnel.
they’re not using the word cause they don’t want to deal with the diaper baby having a tantrum at them, so they are caving to him.
Good point, interesting examples too, thanks.
The fact that trump wont release his medical records to anyone, or even allow the FBI to question him or see his ear, is all the proof you need that he didnt get shot.
We know trumps personality. If his ear really got shot by an actual bullet, He’d be ripping the bandage off at every fucking opportunity and pointing to it and screaming about what biden/the liberals/etc did to him.
You might not understand the importance of the distinction, but Trump does in his messaging.
In an interview with The New York Post in the days after the shooting, Trump said that a bullet had hit him, taking a chunk out of his ear.
“The doctor at the hospital said he never saw anything like this, he called it a miracle,” he said. “I’m not supposed to be here, I’m supposed to be dead.”
He’s touting this as an honest to God miracle that he survived. His followers have said God personally intervened to spare Trump, which strengthens their belief that he’s some sort of holy figure destined to rule. If it turns out that he was scratched by some shrapnel and not shot, that doesn’t sound nearly as divine-interventiony.
Yeah that gives a lot of context. He’s a pathological liar. Unfortunately, people attributing this to an act of God won’t be persuaded by any images or video showing that his ear is fully intact for whatever reason. They’ll assign it as another one of God’s miracles.
So he stood there in a hail of bullets so close he got hit by debris and you’re telling me it wasn’t an act of God?
Sorry, just giving you a preview of their answer. Having been shot at in my life, it doesn’t really matter. They’re going to call those bullets missing him a miracle. Especially because at 100 meters, he should be dead. He’s alive for only one of two reasons, that shooter fucked up or divine intervention.
I love the idea that an all powerful God would be like “sure I could stop this whole thing from happening in a million different ways, but I’m just gonna wait until the last possible microsecond and deflect the bullets into this firefighter instead.”
Sorry God was on her lunch break when the Secret Service did their pre game prayer circle.
No one should be shot at, period. It’s the act of taking a bad thing (where someone did die) and embellish it for use for his advantage. If he had any shame…but…
Yeah this is pretty much the entire point.
Furthermore, denying it isn’t good politics. We’re not going to make his base disbelieve him and we’re going to look like conspiracy theorists to moderate Republicans and centrists unless we have extremely solid evidence.
Until we get that, he was shot, he has recovered. The ear and head area is famous for producing a lot of blood from very little. He was extremely lucky to only be grazed and we all renounce this kind of violence.
It matters because he was wearing a giant bandage. Stop helping him by diffusing this.
“Helping him” is a bit hyperbolic, no? What an enraging take to read. I feel like arguing over this as if it matters gives weight to the idiocy of people who idolize him. I even said I assumed he was hit by a teleprompter. Fuck you. Vote.
Is it very stupid that Souza’s account was deleted for this picture?
Yes.
Is Trump a nonstop POS liar?
Also yes.
Is it possible Trump got astoundingly lucky, and the bullet just barely grazed the top of his earlobe, and this would cause the amount of blood seen, and basically just a superficial scratch?
Again, yes.
This kind of wound is typically called a ‘graze’. It is consistent with the trajectory the shooter was firing from and the direction Trump was facing.
There is another bandage pic of Trump with more localized bandaging which to me indicates the bullet likely just barely grazed the top rear ish of his upper earlobe:
Could it possibly have been caused by shrapnel or fragments of a teleprompter or some other object?
Yes, but, in the case of shattering teleprompter glass, shattered glass fragments are generally more rough and jagged surfaces than a spinning bullet, which on average would lead to an even more fucked up wound and more blood.
I keep hearing this claim that the teleprompter shattering was what actually caused the wound, despite the picture of what seems to literally be the bullet and it warping the air passing in an exact trajectory that would align with an astoundingly lucky and light graze.
Are there pictures, video, audio showing the teleprompter shattered, or being shattered?
Pete Souza posted on Instagram that he suspended his Twitter account himself. Apparently he was receiving a lot of hate (big surprise) and also drew fire inadvertently to the photographer of the photo
“Free speech is the most important thing… But if you call me out on my bullshit I’ll kill your fucking family”
-these people
That’s all fine. But also, Trump could and should just release the record of the medical visit. That would quiet a lot of this down. The outrage comes from the “oh my god I was shot with a bullet” and the “look how strong I am” vibe trump is giving off while also not releasing any real evidence aside from the footage of the day.
But I would suspect all of that to be intentional. A void of information creates a vacuum that fills with misinformation and speculation and that causes discourse which is all trump wants.
Oh yes, I completely agree with you that Trump should release the records of the hospital visit and cooperate with instead of needlessly antagonize investigators.
Unfortunately, he’s Trump, and as you say, he is probably at least somewhat cognizant that a vacuum of information has already lead to baseless speculation, and he certainly knows that in a chaotic miasma of people operating with entirely different ‘facts’, he can later stir the pot to his advantage.
There’s a frame showing both teleprompters intact after he was shot
A picture taken after the attempt showed that both teleprompters were in tact
Souza deleted his own account.
https://thehill.com/policy/technology/4798519-former-white-house-photographer-deletes-x-account/
Allegedly
Did you read his Instagram post linked in the article?
Instagram? I’m not a boomer, man.
Ear lobes are on the bottom
Ok, sure, the technical phrasing would be something like ‘a superficial grazing bullet wound to the exterior, superior portion of the helix of the right ear.’
The picture doesn’t give a 3D placement for the bullet, it doesn’t prove anything. We are seeing an x,y picture without any frame of reference for the z-axis. The trail tells us little due to the limitations of digital photography and the camera used.
The glass fragments are not more rough, that’s not really a good way to describe the two surfaces. The glass also would not have shattered, it would have ruptured. The two are different mechanical differences for what happened. The amount of kinetic energy in the glass fragments would have been very high.
The glass fragments would have been much sharper than the rounded bullet. It’s essentially 1,000 flying small knives bumping into each other.
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The photo could have been mirrored for stylistic purposes, but you’d think the photographer would have come out and said something by now.
Someone in another thread mentioned that it doesn’t appear to be mirrored judging by how Trump has his hair, it’s asymmetrical and stylized toward the left. Hence not mirrored.
There’s just no fucking way his ear was hit by .223 (let alone the hotter 5.56) and there’s still an ear left.
There would be a hole and massive damage, at least. Most likely just a twisted stump.
It’s much more likely that someone scratched it with their fingernail in the chaos and it just bleed a lot because: adrenaline of being shot at, adrenaline of a rally, how high blood pressure is in the ear, and how blood thinners making even a small scratch look like a murder scene.
If he’d really have been shot there’d never have been a bandage and trump wouldn’t go anywhere without 15 doctors in tow to explain how brave and strong he is to survive a gunshot wound.
At minimum he was struck by glass. His reaction was instantaneous with the shots and clearly he was reacting to being hit in the ear. It could have just been reacting to a close fly by at his ear, except the chances of him then being injured and bleeding from the same ear from an agent are slim to none. But however he was injured, it clearly wasn’t much of an injury regardless.
It would be kind of a moot point as he WAS shot at and injured, and a bystander and the shooter were both killed. Those are the important facts here. But then Trump had to throw a fit over the FBI saying they weren’t sure he’d actually been struck by a bullet or by shrapnel. He made such a stink out of it that now that he was clearly barely injured, it just makes him look silly and egotistical (go figure!) for so vehemently insisting he was hit with a bullet.
We could talk about if JD fucked a couch if you want…
I think you overestimate the size and power of a 5.56 round. Much of the destructive force comes from speed and the area it hits - such as the chest or hips. Bones can cause it to ricochet and spin, causing cavitation and greater destruction.
They can leave a tiny entrance wound. With how thin the ear is, it’s unlikely to have left an exit wound any larger than the entrance. It may have even hit the tip of the ear.
Either way, I think there would still be a visible wound unless it just nicked the tip of the ear. The bleeding may be due to blood thinners or something, considering his cardiovascular health.
Much of the destructive force comes from speed
You should’ve stopped there.
If it had hit his ear, it would have ripped a chunk of the ear off, not just caused a scratch that was unnoticeable days later. This isn’t the first time he’s been seen without a bandage. He was photographed like a day later and it was fine.
I think there would still be a visible wound unless it just nicked the tip of the ear
You’re missing the point.
The bullet “nicking” his ear isn’t possible because (due to speed) it would have ripped a chunk off.
The bullet “nicking” his ear isn’t possible because (due to speed) it would have ripped a chunk off.
Please demonstrate this. If a paper target can get hit by these rounds every day in target practice and not get blown to pieces, why would an ear (especially if the ear was only “nicked” by the bullet) be any different?
Yeah, after watching some of the ballistic recreations, it’d either punch through in the case of full hit or nick it pretty good on a grazing hit. Either way, it wouldn’t take a chunk off.
There’d still definitely be a wound, though. I think the most likely case is that he was indirectly hit with some sort of shrapnel.
Personally, it doesn’t matter to me which outcome it was. He was shot at, and very minimally damaged by the bullet or something else. The outcome is the same.
Agreed, although he’s certainly been playing his injury up wearing that ear patch around, when it’s at most been a little scratch.
Paper is thinner and will immediately tear and perfectly so. Squishy thicker flesh will rip and tear slower as the force goes everywhere before the entire region just fails.
Compare the size of the whole to the bullet
The holes is always bigger, and an ear has much more tear resistance than an ear. But Trump doesn’t even have a bullet sized hole in his ear.
He has literally zero visible wounds…
There’s not even a “nick”
The holes on paper aren’t bigger than a bullet. Bullets go fast. .223/5.56 is better than mach 2. That’ll breeze right through a surprising amount of material.
He definitely didn’t have a bullet go through his ear though. Even at a magical angle a bullet wouldn’t be able to go right through.
I kind of think it either barely touched or he got cut when he reached up to touch his ear or something, or a chunk of shrapnel from something else popped him. Honestly, that last one might make the most sense.
Oh, I see. You were using hyperbole and not actually claiming a “nick” by the bullet would take a chunk out of his ear. Fair enough.
Bullets can lacerate tissue without causing crazy destruction. A wound less severe than this on the tip of the ear could be healed within 2 weeks or however long it’s been.
The bullet “nicking” his ear isn’t possible because (due to speed) it would have ripped a chunk off.
This does not follow at all.
If the bullet went directly into his earlobe, yes it obviously would have taken a or multiple chunks out.
If it barely grazed the top of his earlobe, it certainly could have basically just barely knicked it, with only tens or hundreds of microns of the bullet actually contacting tens or hundreds of microns of skin on the ear.
At that scale, a bullet has a microscopically rough surface, and in addition to travelling at a high speed through its trajectory, is also rotating at high speeds.
The analogy I have been taught to make sense of how bullet wounds work is that of a long range, high speed drill press.
In this case, the drill does not so much punch a hole through flesh, as it does basically scrape right on top of an area with a large amount of blood flow under very thin skin.
Much of the destructive force comes from speed
You should’ve stopped there.
Let me rewrite that:
The destructive force of a 5.56 round is exponentially increased by the tissue it hits. If it hits purely soft tissue - such as a pass through the deltoid or quadriceps - it may not cause much damage at all.
The real destruction comes from hitting hard tissue (like bone), which causes it to tumble and cavitate or cause it to ricochet and hit more soft tissue, on top of probably breaking whatever bone it hit.
More than likely it was a slight nick / graze. Not actual full on ear contact.
In case it gets taken down completely:
There have been re-creations on YouTube with ballistics gel and pig ears showing what happens to an ear shot by an AR-15 round, I’m not going to lay judgement, just watch the video:
Ballistics gel (language):
https://youtu.be/FsvJzfXZI18#t=6m59s
Pig ears:
There’s pictures of right after that show his ear…
No bullet wound. Just what seems like an insane amount of blood… If you’ve never seen an excited elderly person on blood thinners get the smallest scratch imaginable.
As an excited elderly person on blood thinners, I absolutely get that. “Hey! Where’d all this blood come from! Oh, wait!”
My dad carried one of those little tubes of super glue…
Bandaids were a waste of time, if he got a cut on his hand he’d just immediately glue it shut.
Thats what super glue was originaly designed as, quick-setting liquid bandages. It also just happens to stick to just about everything else as well.
Bro… my grandmother super glued her earlobe when something caught her earring and literally ripped off of her ear. At that moment, I realized my grandmother was a bad ass woman.
Just gonna leave this here, and additionally note that Trump was heavily involved with professional wrestling for YEARS
Or this… this is the expensive kind…
Welp, my recommendations are about to get a lot more spicy.
Not to mention, a cut above your shoulders (i.e neck ,face,head) will bleed heavily. Now add the adrenaline and you will bleed like a stuck pig or fat Republican.
Must have been a powerful bullet. He got hit in the ear but bled from his mouth.
THANK YOU! Jesus folks, if you don’t have experience with shooting AR-15 loads, just stop, admit you’re not really sure.
Also, I’m thinking a lot of people are imaging the big, bad AR as shooting monster bullets. (That’s a joke pic BTW.) ARs are illegal to hunt with in some states because they’re not deadly enough to produce a clean kill. It’s a military round meant to be incapacitating and lightweight.
What kills me are the states that ban bottleneck cartridges for hunting. Shotguns only. They’re only now coming around and allowing straight walled cartridges.
https://www.remington.com/big-green-blog/what-states-can-you-hunt-with-a-straight-all-cartridge.html
Just saw this and read up a bit. What in the world is the reasoning here?
The feeling is that bottleneck cartridges might have too much penetration and range.
You do realize you can get an AR in 22LR, 9MM, 5.56 NATO etc… right?
Just saw your reply. Yep, I’m aware. I often change the bolt in my AR so I can shoot .22LR.
But we’re discussing what this guy used, not all the myriad options.
From the Herrera vid, the first shot on the lower portion of the ear is more indicative of what, imo, likely occurred, inasmuch as:
There is no missing chunk, it is actually just a graze.
All you have to do is get a shot like that to just barely graze across the top of the upper rear earlobe, as opposed to blowing completely through the ear as their second shot does.
A shot like that, just barely grazing along the upper ear lobe, is consistent with the scene as it played out, as well as the relatively rapid healing of basically a superficial scratch to an area with tons of small blood vessels.
I was thinking he wouldn’t even necessarily need to have actually been hit. The pressure wave from a bullet alone would have been enough to open up a bleedy wound on an ear.
I find that highly unlikely.
It would have made an extremely loud supersonic ‘crack’ or ‘snap’ as it passed very close to his ear and may have caused some degree of temporary, possibly permanent hearing loss, but uh, no the air pressure differential almost certainly would not cause external bleeding.
You can cause blood vessels to burst if you put part of a human body in a significantly low (negative) pressure situation for a significant duration of time, but a .223 passing by would cause no where near the needed negative pressure, it would be for an astoundingly short period of time and finally such pressure differential situations usually cause internal bleeding which is sometimes visible due to the broken capillaries at the top layer of the skin, but this blood pools within the skin and does not break through its surface.
You would need something to actually contact and break the skin for the blood from those broken capillaries to leak outside of the body.
You’d be surprised, here’s an experiment shooting a bullet down the center of a tube made out of aluminum foil:
They don’t specify the caliber, but they do mention it’s going about 1,600fps which is about 1/2 the speed of an AR round.
If that were ear tissue instead of foil, it would get ripped up pretty good.
They say its a slug, meaning its out of a shotgun. They do not mention the gauge, but its safe to say basically any shot gun slug is significantly larger than a .223 round and thus has way, way more air displacement.
Also, they’re using aluminum foil, not human flesh or any kind of analog to it. Utterly, completely different and non analogous material, especially to ‘demonstrate’ what you are claiming it does.
Could a near miss from a .223 or a shotgun slug cause a pressure wave that temporarily makes a bit of your ear wiggle?
Sure, maybe a tiny bit.
Would this cause your ear to start externally bleeding?
No. To verify this, flick your upper ear, such that it moves by a centimeter.
Is your ear now bleeding externally?
Unless you broke the skin with your nail, no, it is not.
My fingertip isn’t going 1,600 feet per second or double that. :)
Adorable grocers
Civil war
Lol
It was just grazed and he might have had it covered with makeup, prosthetic or whatever since.
The conspiracy is crazy.
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This is just misinformation that has been disproved on youtube by many a people and their ar15s already. Not to mention, it could have been shrapnel.
YouTube has a bunch of 2nd shooters?
Some have stated it was shrapnel from the teleprompter being shattered and a chip of it scratching him.
BREAKING NEWS: TRUMP CONTINUES HIS MASSIVE STREAK OF UNABATED LYING
😱
I still expect Trump’s ear wound appearance was fixed with cosmetics, I mean why wouldn’t they? He doesn’t want to look like Frankenstein. I got downvoted to hell in another thread for posting that though.
Are you insane? There is no way Trump would pass up that sort of imagery.
No, trump is vain and an attention seeker. Hed rather talk about the ear while looking perfect. (He also has a distorted self-image but that’s another thing)
He could have just kept wearing the bandage, if he wanted that.
I was fully expecting the bandage to stay on for months.
But you can’t expect anything from the guy, so…
I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if he forgot he got shot.
People started making fun of him for it. He is fragile enough that being called out for his sanitary pad ear would probably bother him.
I do not agree. I think he see it a sign of weakness. He wants everything to look perfect, there are no way he want to look week.
Since when are scars a sign of weakness. They scream courage or bravery to me
He literally made fun of a war prisoner because he got caught! We are talking a bout trump here.
Fair enough…
Why wouldn’t they? Because they want to sell the strong tin leader narrative. I’m surprised he took the bandage off. I’m surprised he isn’t wearing a T-shirt with his little PR photo tiny-handed fist in the air. I’m sure he asks his sycophants if it looked more manly than the photo of shirtless Putin riding a stallion.
He is incredibly vain.
He’s a real boy now.
Because it will raise eyebrows
That was my first thought too. Makeup to cover it up. I didn’t know why you’d be DVed, except my Trump Cultists maybe. As if he’s not always caked in bronzer as is. Guys can wear makeup - every actor in Hollywood does, at the very least.
Since his base is so evangelical, sometimes a bible quote is apt:
And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
- Revelations 13:3
Enough has been said - sense and nonsense - about the facts and particulars of this. I just want to add one thing:
The image, taken by Alex Brandon of the Associated Press
Let’s go, Brandon.
“Jesus was a healer and he healed Trump” narrative incoming. Kamala being the new nominee stole all his thunder anyways, so who cares?
You’d think with how much he panders to the evangelicals he’d be right on top of showing them all just how holey he is 🤷
Revelations 13:3 is a better christian narrative for it.
Revelations 13:3 One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast.
Musk can and will have his database team wipe accounts and posts from behind the scenes without making it appear like the user was banned.
Donald Trump photo without eyebrow bandage raises ears.
I hate to defend Trump, but as someone who had a cartilage piercing accidentally torn out, I can attest to the insane amounts of blood that can come from a rather small ear wound.
It wasn’t even an insane amount of blood in the pic I saw…
No, but it really could splatter all over his face from a very small cut.
A bit conspiratorial. A very minor gunshot wound can heal within weeks according to Google, and the ear has so many bits in it which seem to pop and make a lot of blood easily enough. You even saw the blood on the live footage as well as the photos taken, so I don’t see how he could have faked it
Because fake blood doesn’t exist right?
How’d he get it on so quickly?
I also dont believe it was faked. Dude got hit with something , but he went down for a couple seconds. More than enough time for a blood pill or a blade job. Wrestling has taught us it can be super quick.
Wouldn’t the hospital be able to tell, though?
Let’s see the medical report.
I demand to see the long-form medical report! The earer movement cannot be stopped!
Would the hospital be able to tell us either way?
Fair point
Anyone else just kind of forget about the assassination attempt? I guess that goes in line with Trump always doing new bullshit that nothing sticks, it’s become so common that even the assassination attempt doesn’t really feel notable already.
It was very anti cliamactic.
Duh! One of the great benefits of skin suits is how easy they are to repair.
Has it been determined that he most likely was hit by a bullet vs. shrapnel?
The FBI said it was a bullet.
Not sure why this was downvoted. That’s what I heard too. FBI said it was a bullet or bullet fragment. They don’t seem to think it’s from something else like teleprompter glass. He probably just barely got hit with a tiny fragment.
There was an article 3/4 days ago in a debreif the FBI said they don’t believe it was a bullet and was most likely shrapnel but they didn’t confirm either.
That’s exactly what I heard, and haven’t heard anything to contradict it.
