My brother is 12 and just like other people of his age he can’t use a computer properly because he is only familiar with mobile devices and dumbed-down computers

I recently dual-booted Fedora KDE and Windows 10 on his laptop. Showed him Discovery and told him, “This is the app store. Everything you’ll ever need is here, and if you can’t find something just tell me and I’ll add it there”. I also set up bottles telling him “Your non-steam games are here”. He installed Steam and other apps himself

I guess he is a better Linux user than Linus Sebastian since he installed Steam without breaking his OS…

The tech support questions and stuff like “Can you install this for me?” or “Is this a virus?” dropped to zero. He only asks me things like “What was the name of PowerPoint for Linux” once in a while

After a week I have hardly ever seen my brother use Windows. He says Fedora is “like iOS” and he absolutely loved it

I use Arch and he keeps telling me “Why are you doing that nerdy terminal stuff just use Fedora”. He also keeps explaining to me why Fedora better than my “nerd OS”

  • Blizzard@lemmy.zip
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    19
    arrow-down
    6
    ·
    1 year ago

    Why are you doing that nerdy terminal stuff

    That is a legitimate question. I still don’t fully understand people’s obsession about terminal. It’s 2023, we should be able to do everything comfortably using GUI rather than type everything, remembering all the commands, parameters, paths, permissions etc.

    • zygo_histo_morpheus@programming.dev
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      28
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      As a terminal fan, my main reasons for preferring them over a gui (for some tasks) are:

      1. It’s faster to type than to navigate menus
      2. If I don’t know where something is and can’t guess it instantly, it’s usually faster to search for it in a man page than randomly digging through gui menus
      3. You can combine commands with each other with pipes or $()
      4. You can search through your command history to find previous commands
      5. You can write scripts and aliases to automate common tasks
      6. The terminal requires less context switching. Typing ten commands is less mentally taxing than opening ten different guis

      The barrier for entry is higher with terminals but unless you need visual feedback (e.g. because you’re editing an image) it’s easier and faster for both common and rare tasks.

      • oshitwaddup@lemmy.antemeridiem.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        9
        ·
        1 year ago

        And even for some types of image editing, terminal is way faster and easier. Some of the things i’ve done that are a simple command with imagemagick i wouldn’t even know which gui app to install, let alone how to do it

      • joel_feila@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Well some if those are only true for smie people. Add in a vad case of dyslexia and it get real hard to kniw if what you just tyoed is correct, and does any cli have a spell checker.

        • zygo_histo_morpheus@programming.dev
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Fair enough, I’m not against people making guis as well for people who prefer them for whatever reason, my point is that people don’t just prefer terminals because of elitism or something. I imagine terminals can be better than guis for some disabilities as well.

    • fsniper@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      11
      ·
      1 year ago

      Because it just works ™. And it is flexible to a point that no GUI can ever accomplish. It’s liberating. It’s repeatable, It’s automatable. It’s about control. And most importantly, it’s FAST!

      If you try to max out the control, GUI comes out of as an UX disaster. Check any enterprise software GUI to see what I mean. There will be lot’s and lot’s of buttons all around, and you would also end up with some kind of text input or programming environment inside it.

    • tikitaki@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      I agree in certain circumstances. For example a file manager I don’t understand why people use in a terminal. When I need to do like batch deletions or something I can easily just write a couple terminal commands. Everything else I just use the default file manager. Either Finder on MacOS or the Gnome one on Linux.

      But stuff like vim, a terminal text editor, is simply more fluid and enjoyable than a GUI program. I’ve tried using vim plugins for various different GUI text editors like Sublime or VS Code but there’s nothing like a personalized vim install. It takes a little bit to get used to the commands, but once you do it’s like riding a bike. You just feel faster and muscle memory takes care of the rest. You don’t actively think about it

      same thing with for example package managers. it’s faster to just press my hotkey to open up terminal, type in “sudo dnf install <whatever>” and it’s installed. why do we need a GUI here? it doesn’t make anything faster. In fact, it just gets in the way.

      so some things GUIs don’t actually improve. Some they do. It’s a per case thing I think

    • ScreaminOctopus@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s way easier to communicate a terminal based solution over the internet. Instead of making a guide with images, possibly needing annotation, you can just say “run x, y, z in order” and the user can just copy and paste it (even though it’s a bad habit to run random commands off the internet)

    • Sloogs@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      I mean you could certainly have both but Linux treating its terminal as a first class interface is a big part of why it’s still used so much in the server/dev world I think. Having a command line interface that’s not an afterthought, fully scriptable, and can be automated is very convenient whereas on Windows you have things like PowerShell where not every program you want to do things with in PowerShell has a way to interact with PowerShell, since in Windows you have the opposite problem of GUI being the only first class interface.

    • spiritedaway@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      You still need similar memorisation when using a GUI.

      You don’t give the GUI process a second thought as you’re used to the steps, similar to those using the terminal.

      For example, in Windows to create a new text file, save it, and copy it.

      You need to know the name of the application (notepad), how to find and open it from the Start menu, the steps within notepad to save the file and the path to save to (file -> save -> navigate to path), the name of the file explorer (Windows Explorer) and how to find and open it, how to navigate to the file, the steps to copying a file (right click copy or ctrl-c), and pasting the file (right click paste or ctrl-v).

      On the terminal, it’s a case of remembering commands/switches:
      vim document.txt
      :wq (write quit)
      cp document.txt documentnew.txt
      rm document.txt

      Both processes require memorisation of specific sequence of steps which overtime you’ll become accustom to and not have to actively think about when repeating a similar process.

      My preference is the terminal as it is quicker and simpler in most instances and without the clutter of everything that comes with a GUI application.

      • Affidavit@aussie.zone
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago
        1. Press the Super/Windows button
        2. Type the letter ‘n’ (or ‘t’ if on most Linux distros)
        3. Press the ‘Return’ key.

        Congratulations, you now opened Notepad / Random open source text editor.

        1. Ctrl + S = Save for pretty much everything

        The above pattern works for almost every program. There is no need to memorise the ridiculously inconsistent nuances of the 4 different commands you specified.

        9/10 times I personally prefer GUI over terminal for efficiency. With three buttons I already have a text editor open. At this point, you’ve just started typing the letter ‘v’ in your first step.

    • DV8@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      There should be a good GUI for everything but a terminal offers more options to do certain things a lot faster. Especially in work environments. And once you’re used to this level of efficiency and control you’re not likely to stop doing that in your home network.

    • LinyosT@sopuli.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      I just find certain things to be quicker in the terminal than doing it through a GUI.

      Like installing software. I think it’s quicker and more direct to do something like sudo pacman -S Firefox than to go through a gui. Especially if Im using a drop down terminal that I have hot keyed.

      As for remembering everything, I’d say it’s just a matter of experience. Like, you had to learn how to use a GUI app at one point or another.

    • 30isthenew29@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      This is what sucks about Linux. It’s still not as complete as Windows in that regard… Things being too techy, even the real user friendly ones still got it.

      • taladar@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        You got this the wrong way around. Windows is lacking a proper terminal. You are at the mercy of constantly redesigned GUIs for literally everything. Windows is an absolute pain to use if you aren’t used to it and have developed a certain amount of Stockholm syndrome.