Tishby said: “One side is a democracy and, like any other democracy, it’s a flawed democracy. The other side is a jihadi genocidal organization that is fully committed to your annihilation.
Oh, pardon me, if y’all voted for genocide then that’s completely different, good point.
I think your quoted text is an excellent and succinct point, and absolutely true.
In the democracy, there is hope for lasting human rights for tens of millions of people.
Hamas has no future. It would be a lot cooler if they stopped using human shields but your sympathy is part of their strategy, that’s why those civilians are dead.
Those civilians are dead because the IDF killed them. It’s really that simple. Being human shields doesn’t mean you can bomb them. Asshole.
I agree you can’t just bomb people because they are standing next to a military target. You have to warn them first.
Such as by calling them on the phone, sending texts, air dropping leaflets, and firing warning shots, all of which the IDF does.
Uh huh, then they turn around and bomb the safe zone.
These are ongoing things not one and done. Look up whatever specific incident you think you know about and then research to find the warnings that went out before it.
Further reading: https://www.idf.il/en/mini-sites/the-hamas-terrorist-organization/how-is-the-idf-minimizing-harm-to-civilians-in-gaza/
A self-defense military operation against insane terrorists is not genocide in any way.
You’re right. However, the rest is genocide.
No. Genocide isn’t a term you can throw around lightly, something you don’t like isn’t genocide just because you think it is. There is no genocide in Palestine, and it’s horrendously offensive to even suggest that such a thing is occurring.
I agree with you, but found out real quick that people on here really do believe the over the top rhetoric with respect to this religious war. Now I generally just pass on by without commenting. This being an exception. The better to gather downvotes I suppose.
It’s good to know you support the killing of 10s of thousands of innocent civilians, many women and children, and the forced starvation of at least half a million people. Of course though, because they are Arab means they don’t count as people right?
Exactly! That type of rhetoric. Just fascinating.
Okay psycho.
Telling people they shouldn’t talk about genocide is horrendously offensive.
Trivializing actual genocide by just throwing the word around is also horrendously offensive.
Trivializing actual genocide by dismissing it is horrendously offensive.
South Africa is making the case that it’s genocide, that’s not to be taken lightly and it’s not just random people saying it is.
There’s been plenty of evidence. Look at the one-sided settler violence that’s been happening in West Bank, the people killed there are by and large uninvolved with the October massacre and terrorist attacks, including the American-Palestinian boy from Louisiana.
Israel kills doctors: https://www.npr.org/2023/11/16/1213307710/gaza-doctors-al-shifa-hospital
Israel kills journalists, some intentionally: https://cpj.org/2024/01/journalist-casualties-in-the-israel-gaza-conflict/
Israel kills children: https://www.telegraphindia.com/world/strike-kills-12-people-mostly-children-in-gaza-area-declared-safe-zone-by-israel/cid/1991673 (and are a significant portion of the reported 25000 dead from the conflict)
Israel strikes locations where it tells civilians to evacuate to for safety: https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/israel-hamas-war-day-59-1.7048019
I have nothing against Jews or people who are from Israel. We have to stop supporting and sanction the IDF and Israeli government’s policy of recklessly inflicting non-combatant casualties in the region.
Look who joined South Africa’s complaint. That’s all you need to know. Look who’s line you’re towing right now. Paragraph 12 of South Africa’s application.
Presidents of Algeria, Bolivia, Brazil, Colombia, Cuba, Iran, Türkiye, and Venezuela have all described Israel’s actions as a genocide, as has the Palestinian President. State officials and representatives from Bangladesh, Egypt, Honduras, Iraq, Jordan, Libya, Malaysia, Namibia, Pakistan, Syria, and Tunisia.
Find them credible on human rights?
JustZionism
They’re bulldozing graveyards.
There are tunnels underneath the entire city and the entire landscape is unstable.
I will repeat this again, the IDF could kill your mother and you’ll just say there was a tunnel in her head.
Ridiculous. My mother isn’t in the West Bank and she doesn’t launch any rockets at anyone.
This is an incredibly biased article that elevates a voice equating the support of ending the Palestinian genocide with anti-semitism, which is demonstrably false.
There is no “Palestinian genocide”. It absolutely is not happening.
There is no war in Ba Sing Se
What, absolutely, do you imagine is happening?
Gaza is controlled by terrorists who launched an attack against Israel and Israel is responding to the attack. Civilians die in war, but the Israeli goal is very clearly not genocide.
It’d be nice if they’d stop bombing hospitals and depriving millions of people of the basic necessities of survival then. Oh, and it’d also be nice if they’d stop referring to Palestinians as animals and shooting children in the west bank. And It’d be nice if Netanyahu would stop saying his goal is to annex the west bank and the Gaza strip. And if the Israeli state would stop encouraging settlers to illegally (by their own laws) occupy the west bank.
The attack was also 3 months ago. And tens of thousands of Palestinians have been murdered since then.
It’s not annexation, it’s called irredentism in this circumstance. Gaza is uninhabitable from structural and civil engineering standpoints because of Hamas’s tunnels. It has no capacity or resources to make itself safe. It has also proven it has no ability or desire to actually root out Hamas. So now their neighbor is morally obligated to do it for them.
Gaza is uninhabitable because the IDF levelled every fucking building there.
Right. Someone dug tunnels under them all and then launched decades of terrorist attacks from them. October 7 was the last end of the rope.
“neighbor” is a funny way to describe an occupying force that has kept them under siege with no end in sight.
I agree. Civilian death tolls have been rapidly going down, not increasing. The airstrikes match up with the tunnels systems. There is no credibility to claims of “indiscriminate” bombings. The high number of civilian casualties is simply and readily explained by the fact that Hamas refused to let people evacuate and forced them to remain behind to be used as human shields and martyrs. High civilian casualties is one of Hamas’s weapons, and with Iran’s influence campaigns and astroturfing, it’s working to trick a lot of people whose ignorance and gullibility are going to allow Trump to win another term.
The only countries who’ve joined South Africa’s complaint to the UN criminal court are dictatorships, authoritarian , and/or theocratic shitholes such as Iran, Syria, Bahrain, Iraq, Brazil, Venezuela, Malaysia, and Cuba. The question South Africa’s complaint raises, after sorting through the circular logic, recursive reasoning, and claims attributed to incredible sources or simply “reports,” is when did South Africa start doing Iran’s bidding?
There’s been some heinous war crimes committed by IDF soldiers, maybe even a culture that causes soldiers to go too far. Those are the exception, by a lot. I have faith that, as a democracy, credible accusations will be investigated and charged within the customs of Israel’s military justice system, and most reports of atrocities have been highly exaggerated, recursive, and/or lack basic indicia of credibility.
“match up with tunnel systems” they leveled countless city blocks. They’ve bombed hospitals, they tell Palestinians to go to one part of Gaza where they say it’s “safe” and then they bomb there too. Over 20,000 people dying is not a fucking accident, it’s all intentional. They aren’t even letting them eat or have water. Forced starvation and dehydration among the whole population, oh wow yeah that really doesn’t sound like they’re trying to get rid of all of them.
I wouldn’t bother with this person. Stopped ages ago. They know all this information. Sadly when you’re stuck in tunnel vision, no facts or evidence or rationales will ever get you out.
To them everything can be explained by Hamas.
Is Hamas in the room with us right now?
Doesn’t matter what their goal is. It matters what their actions cause.
Causing high civilian casualties is literally Hamas’s strategy, holding their families as human shields, preventing people from evacuating, etc.
Isn’t that the superceding cause of virtually every civilian death?
The superseding cause of virtually every civilian death in Gaza is an IDF bullet or bomb.
I don’t agree. If the IDF warns people before they bomb a building and people refuse to leave the building, it’s their refusal that is the superceding cause, it’s a knowing assumption of risk.
Good actual example. First or second week of the war north of Gaza City. Everyone had already been airdropped leaflets and received masses text and emergency broadcast warnings to evacuate and head south and that anyone who stayed behind was in extreme danger. A few hundred thousand people did not evacuate.
IDF stumbles across a tunnel section is wanted to bomb underneath several blocks of apartments. Israel, as a world leader in the development of strategies to avoid civilian casualties, uses the cell phone network to call people still in the buildings. They start running door to door, IDF stays on the phone and promises not to bomb until the people leading the evacuations say everyone is clear.
As they evacuate, a number of people refuse. Hamas has been spreading Facebook posts saying that the calls are a hoax. They tell the caller, “prove this is real, fire a warning shot.” Bam, warning shot goes off. They say “there’s a lot of bombing, prove it’s real and do another warning,” bam another warning shell. They are convinced and so they continue evacuating. Everyone gets out, a resident tells the IDF it’s clear, several city blocks get demolished when IDF blew up the tunnels. 3,600 people used to live there and there were zero civilian casualties. The tunnels were completed destroyed.
In my view, the superceding cause to the apartments falling down was when Hamas built a tunnel underneath them and then used them to launch a massive terrorist attack–involving thousands of rockets (fired actually indiscriminately against civilians targets and infrastructure) and mass shootings at concerts and restaurants, on families just driving down the road, and on first responders who came in response to the gunfire–and then retreated back into those same tunnels, making them legitimate military targets.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67327079
This story is the exception only because everyone agreed to leave.
If people had refused to leave or been tricked or forced to stay behind by Hamas, in my example above, the superceding cause of their deaths would have been Hamas spreading rumors, in addition to all the propaganda is has already spread about dying with honor as martyrs, which caused people not to evactuate in the first place.
I guess the October 7 attackers thought they would retreat back into the tunnels and Israel was just going to say “darn, guess they got away!”
High civilian causalities? Are you serious? Whonos the one that killed over 20,000 people? Who are the ones starving half a million people? Is it Hamas? No Its Israel. “High civilian causalities” my ass. The IDF also caused some of the causalities on October 7th too. They shot indiscriminately and hit their own people.
Yes friendly fire in the chaos of hundreds of mass shooting, active shooter events.
In my country, that sort of chaos is why we have the felony murder rule and why it’s been used in past incidents of friendly fire to properly charge the criminals with such needless deaths, if first responders accidentally shoot each other or a bystander.
You’re blaming the victims.
Okay yeah sure. Thats why the Israeli Minister of Defense said “We will eliminate everything” among many other things said and done:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegations_of_genocide_in_the_2023_Israeli_attack_on_Gaza
Allegations. UN member countries that support South Africa’s complaint at the UN:
Presidents of Algeria, Bolivia, Brazil, Colombia, Cuba, Iran, Türkiye, and Venezuela have all described Israel’s actions as a genocide, as has the Palestinian President. State officials and representatives from Bangladesh, Egypt, Honduras, Iraq, Jordan, Libya, Malaysia, Namibia, Pakistan, Syria, and Tunisia.
They all have such impressive credibility on human rights and totally don’t have an ax to grind against or an Iran to suck up to. /s
Because you like to pick and choose things to make your “argument” of accepting genocide, let me just quote all of the high ranking Israel officials saying God awful Nazi shit:
Netanyahu said “You must remember what Amalek has done to you, says our Holy Bible.” The Bible says “Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants.”
IDF Major general Giora Eiland wrote “Gaza will become a place where no human being can exist”.[23] He added “Creating a severe humanitarian crisis in Gaza is a necessary means to achieving the goal.”[23] Israeli historian Omer Bartov writes that no Israeli politician nor anyone in the IDF denounced this statement.
The spokesperson for the Israeli army said, in regards to Israel’s bombing of Gaza, “the emphasis is on damage not accuracy”. This statement was interpreted by legal scholars as intention of destruction.
Look at these Israeli Nazis creating their own little holocaust.
You may want to read this article. It clarifies the misunderstandings you are referencing in your comment. The statements to which you are referring are mistranslated and misunderstood.
Gaza is controlled by Israel
It’s pretty insane that people can just say these straight up Nazi takes on here and not get banned but if you say anything slightly controversial the other way around suddenly it’s a huge problem.
How did a Zionist hijack more than half this article to spread racist propaganda
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